All right. What’s up everybody? Welcome to the fit to fat to fit experience podcast. I’m your host, drew Manning from Thank you guys so much for tuning into my podcast today. Some of you guys, if you don’t know who I am, I am the guy that did the Fitbit to feature any right. I’m going to have gained gain 75 pounds in six months on purpose as a personal trainer to discover what it was like for me, uh, for the first time, what it was like to be overweight. And so it was a very humbling, uh, but positive experience in the end, even though it was really hard. I learned a lot of valuable lessons and now there’s a hit TV show on a and E called fit tread fit where I coach other trainers to do what I did to hopefully come through more empathetic with more respect for their clients and a better understanding of what their clients go through and just how hard it really is.

Um, and so we are currently filming season two of that. If he has watch out on you guys. We have a good friend of ours. Um, if you guys check out Instagram, um, whole fork, uh, Tiffany is our good friends. So Tiffany is a former chemist with a degree in biology. Uh, she lives here in Northern Utah. Actually first met her at an expo and she had a, she’s a very popular, like a blogger, fitness and nutrition blogger. She’s got a ton of recipes on her website and it was, we brought her on because of her unique background as a scientist and specifically we actually dive into essential oils, you guys and some surprising things kind of controversial because I know people get very passionate about essential oils. She dies into her past job, um, teaching people how to use a portable mass spec trauma tree, uh, spectrometry.

I’m not sure if I said that right. Anyway, she used to travel all around the world, uh, teaching this and she kind of would do these chemical analyses of, uh, you know, on essential oils. These companies would hire her. So when as we dive into that, but we also dive into some misconceptions, some myths about the paleo diet, how her, uh, nutrition philosophy has evolved over the years and how she differentiates from a strict paleo diet to more of a balanced approach now and why from a scientific perspective. She’s very smart. She’s very beautiful. She’s actually one of the prettiest scientists that you’ll see. Um, so she’s great. I think you guys will really enjoy this episode. A lot of great gyms in this episode. Um, so, uh, so I think you’ll really enjoy it. Anyways, before we dive into the episode, you guys are show sponsors for today.

The first one is Everly, That’s III, V E R L Y w E L So last week I had on dr Murdock [inaudible], um, who’s the chief medical officer of this company. So basically it’s an a in home, um, medical blood testing, uh, company. They send you a kit, so you order your tests that you want to do. Let’s say it’s cholesterol, your basic lipid profile. They have a sleep and stress test. They have your thyroid test, your testosterone tests, yo. So, and some other hormones. Um, they have a great variety of tests that you can order, which are uh, convenient to, they’re affordable. They send you the kit in your house, you guys. So basically prick your finger at home. It tells you through the instructions exactly what to do. You put it in in the little device and you wrap it up and the prepaid ups packaging and you just drop it off at a ups place or schedule a pickup.

So it’s, you know, you don’t have to schedule a doctor appointment, you don’t have to wait around at doctor’s offices. You don’t have to pay expensive copays or anything like that. It’s a very affordable pricing and it just makes it so much more convenient. So check it out every for slash fit to fat to fit for 10% off your first purchase of any of the tests. Um, and or use the code fit to fat to fit at checkout for this discount, uh, every our next show sponsored you guys is quest nutrition. Now, here’s the thing about quest, you guys, they have evolved over the years. I’ve been friends with them for years, ever since. They were just a basic, you know, protein bar company. They revolutionized the protein bar industry I believe. And now they’ve evolved. So now I’m a huge fan of their keto snacks, which aren’t technically available to the public.

You have to sign up under their quest labs. So you sign up as a member and when they release new products or they have more inventory, they’ll email you and let you know, like when you can order these types of keto snacks. So they have like these Cheez-Its what’s there are amazing. They have these chalk Kito chocolate bars. Cause as you know, I’m a big fan of ketosis, but I mean other than that, they have such a wide variety of, you know, good tasting, healthy snacks and you can even find their quest bars now in Walmart. So they finally made it there. And in Walmarts, they’re in airports, they’re in gas stations. Uh, so check them All right you guys, let’s go hang out with Tiffany. All right. What’s up everybody? We want to welcome to the show Tiffany brand. How are you doing today Tiffany?

I’m doing very well. Thank you. We’ve known Tiffany for awhile. I’ve had tea. I’ve shared tacos with Tiffany. Oh yes.

So I just for the audience I had met Tiffany at, was it at fit con first or was it a different fitness expo?

Um, actually I think it was a pinners expo. Non fitness related actually. Yes,

yes. We uh, that’s where we first met and then she knew Lynn through the same kind of community of women. And um,

we have a group of women that occasionally we go eat good food with and it’s marvelous. It is absolutely marvelous. Yeah. And I’ve had many a good conversation with Tiffany, so we’re so excited to have her on the podcast. A couple of things we’re going to talk about today, what I talked about with Tiffany, my was blown

for like days. I was like, she is a wealth of good information. She’s such an intelligent woman. She’s amazing. She’s a scientist and she’s, you know, a pretty scientist, which is

making me blush.

No, I’m just saying, you know, you don’t find that very often, but, um, we are going to touch on some scientific topics with Tiffany. But first Tiffany, I got to ask you where it tells the story of how you came up with the brand whole fork.

Okay. Um, well I started whole fork a couple of years ago just as an Instagram account where I was keeping myself accountable for eating healthy and I was focusing on whole foods specifically. And um, of course it was all based on eating. So I just kind of put together the name, whole fork and I found Instagram to be this inspiring place where I could see what other people were eating. And um, so I just started posting the healthy food that I was creating and looking for inspiration in that community. And then it just started growing and growing and growing. And I’m not exactly sure why, but that account just grew. One day it hit over 10,000 followers. And at that point my husband was like, you need to do something with this. Why don’t you start a blog or something? And so that’s what I did. And now I have the website, whole, and that’s where I share healthy recipes, most of which are paleo, but not all paleo. So that’s kind of my focus is whole foods.

Yeah. So, uh, so the, the name, whole fork, where did you come up with Everett instead of whole spoon or whole knife?

Uh, I don’t know for it to sounded cleaner, I guess.

Gotcha. Okay. So let’s kind of back up. Tell us like, did you grow up here in Utah? Where did you grow up?

Yeah, I did. I grew up here in Utah, um, just an hour North of salt Lake city and a very small farming community. And my parents were not farmers. Um, they’re scientists and that’s kinda how I grew up. But I grew up in the middle of all these peach orchards and we shopped at the farmer’s market regularly and just at the, all the fruit stands and it was awesome.

That is so cool. So that’s what I was going to ask you is how you decided to become a chemist. So I’m guessing that came from your parents, right?

Yes. Well, my family, they’re all engineers and I actually decided, I got my degree in biology and I always, I joke that I was like the disappointment of the family because I wasn’t an engineer. Um, but then oddly enough, most of the jobs here in Utah, um, were more based on chemistry and so most of my professional career has been as a chemist.

Yeah. So tell us a little bit about that. What you studied specifically as a chemist and then what was your first job as a chemist? Like what were you doing?

My first job, it was actually working for the department of defense out in Dugway as a civilian. Um, and it was working more on the protection side of protecting people against chemical and biological threats. And that led me to, um, another job that, that we’ll talk about a little bit cause some of the topics that we wanted to hit on. But, um, I ended up working a lot in chemical detection and being able to identify chemicals

and certain products or foods or what specifically

actually we made instrumentation that did the detection. And so my job was to be an expert on detecting anything and everything. So it went from detecting pesticides in tealeaves to detecting chemical warfare agents in dirt samples. And, um, my job was to work with customers to help them figure out how to be able to detect what they were looking for inside whatever kind of crazy sound it was.

Wow. So amazing. Is that where this portable mass spec spectrometry this way that say that right? Trauma tree comes into play.

Yeah. So the real, the full thing is I did gas chromatography, mass spectrometry.

It’s a mouth. I have no idea what that is. Can I do that? Sometimes in my spare time I like to break the mental sweat too. Um, yeah. So is it, and that’s what portable mass spectrometry is, is what you were saying, detecting those chemicals. Yeah.

So basically it just did two things. You would put a complex mixture of something inside the instrument. And the first part of it, it would separate it all down into individual chemicals and then the second part of the instrument would actually be able to identify what those individual vehicles are.

Okay. I can, I can comprehend that what you’re saying there. And what were some of the most surprising things that you found or the most shocking things that you’ve found and some of these, you know, samples,

the European union, they highly regulate things and so they wanted to use our instrument for quality control and they have a lot of regulations about that. And so I really love European products because they are very, very clean. Um,


they are. And I think the U S is a little bit behind on some of that, but um, nothing was too surprising. Um, we, we were going to talk about essential oils. I don’t know when you want to talk about that.

I would love to talk about that right first before we get into that. Okay.

I did just get back from Europe when drew had the kids. I did a month long backpacking through Europe and I loved it. And I must say I was most surprised by how my body responded to all the foods. Um, I mean everybody knows I’m a foodie. Everybody makes comments about how I eat. Maybe what they think is, it’s too much sugar, excuse me, too much sugar or junk food or bread. But I believe in intuitive eating. I listened to my body, I eat plenty of fruits and vegetables and great lean meats as well as as of course bread and sugar from time to time. But what was interesting is in Europe when I was eating, I never had any digestion issues. I never had any bloating, I never had any gas. If everyone thinks this is too M TMI, sorry, but like my digestion was great. I was regular. Like I felt amazing. And it’s funny because on the plane ride home, Delta gave me those like little Biscoff cookies and I had like a sandwich of theirs or sandwich wrap and I’d been having sandwiches all through Europe. I got crazy bloated, I felt sick and I was like, what is happening to me? I swear the, the, the food and the way things are made in Europe, it’s just different.

What are some of the specifics, Tiffany, that you see between the European union and like here in America that we need to catch up on?

Um, well a lot of what we consider natural products, like essential oils specifically those, those are regulated in the EU where they’re, they’re quality controlled, they’re screened for chemicals and they have to meet certain standards before they can, they can hit the consumer or the, you know, the market. And we just, we don’t do that. And so there’s a lot of us that think, Oh, we’re doing all these healthy natural things. When truth is, a lot of our products are just loaded with a ton of crap. And it’s just like Lynn said, um, you know, part of my job, uh, I was in charge of 22 international distributors for that instrument, that chemical detection instrument. So I traveled the world and I just like Lynn, I am a huge foodie. I ate my way through Europe, I ate my way through Asia and you know, I could eat over there with just no restraint and I would never, I’d never gained weight. I would never get bloated. And then I’d come home and if I ate with those same portions, man I would, I would get really sick. So we just, we add a lot of chemicals and preservatives and additives that are really not necessary and we need to cut back on that. Yeah,

I’m in, you know, and the other really one of the most interesting conversations I ever had was with Tiffany regarding, and I know this is going to be controversial, so here’s the deal. I am all for everybody doing what works best for their body. And I’m definitely a very open minded person where I feel like what works for one doesn’t necessarily work for other. And honestly, if somebody, if, if somebody is just happy using oils, I’m happy with that. But, um, we’re kind of in this phase where it seems like a lot of people have gone through this, you know, oils or everything, you know, they’re going to cure diseases and headaches and you know, if you’re don’t go to the doctor anymore, use oils. And people were like Hawking them to me like crazy. Especially because a lot of them are multilevel marketing and I’m not against multilevel marketing. I think it’s great when people can, can use something that they’re passionate about to build a business. But I have always, you know, I’ve tried a bunch of different oils. None of them really did anything for me per se, but it was really interesting talking to Tiffany about oils since she actually had to, you know, research them, dissect them, find out what was in them. So I would love for you Tiffany, to talk a little bit about what you found in your research to do with oils.

Sure. Um, so let me start off by saying I do use some essential oils, but somewhat infrequently, um, as a scientist I can see where there’s value in certain chemicals because certain chemicals will do certain things in our bodies and if we can use them in a positive way, I think that’s great. And certain essential oils contain chemicals that can really help us. Where that wholesale market really turns me off is I think people treat them like they’re magic. And I really get turned off by the woo factor that, that people seem to have about them. And people get almost religious about it. And there’s a lot of misinformation out there about oils even by the companies that produce them. And when they talk about, um, things like parts of plants and where the oil is and what the oil actually does, they talk about it like it’s the blood of the plant.

And that is simply not true. Many of those fragrances are there not to nourish the plant or, or to give it the lifeblood really. That’s minerals and water. But really those oils are there to like attract or detract certain bugs. And animals and um, especially bees so that things can be pollinated. And so we get these weird magical, mystical ideas about oils that I just, I don’t like. But with my chemistry background and the job that I had, um, we had several of the big name companies that you’ve all heard of, they were really interested in, in this instrument that we made for detection because they would want be able to test the purity of oil. So if they were going to buy something from India or South America or something, they would want it to be able to test it to do some quality control and make sure that it had the fragrance profile, that, that it was meeting a certain standard every single time so that all of their batches were the same.

And so they would send us a bunch of samples just so that we can test them out and they can see the different profiles and see if our instrument would show them kind of what they’re looking for. And as I was testing these oils, I was actually really, really shocked about the amount of non plant chemical that was in them. And specifically I’m going to talk about hexane, um, because hexane um, they use as a solvent extraction and I know hexane is as chemical name, but we’re actually all familiar with hexane because it’s largely what gasoline is made of and it is not healthy in any way, shape or form. And um, why they have hexane or some of them have hexane in them. Um, I started doing some digging and it turns out that some, some oils when you extract them from the plant, you have to use a chemical to get the oil out of the plant.

And this is called solvent extraction. And so I am all about people being educated, doing your homework and if you want to look into it, please just do a quick Google search on solvent extraction with essential oils. And this is mostly done with botanicals or flowers, stuff like Jasmine. And so if, if this really turns you off, then I would say avoid the oils that have flowers in them. Um, but the way this is done, solvents are like alcohols and they can help pull the oil out of the plant material, especially when there isn’t a lot of oils like in delicate flowers. And so the European union, they actually regulate essential oils and they require that the solvents are less than what I believe is 10 part per million in the oil. And the sad thing is here in the U S we don’t have any type of this regulation. And so I don’t want to raise this big huge red flag and say, you know, all of this is actually dangerous. That is not what I’m saying at all. These are, it’s pretty low level. But for you people that think that you are rubbing a hundred percent pure oil on your skin, you’re not, you’re, you, you just, you’re not, and for you to think that you’re taking something that is safer than a medication, I, I wouldn’t agree with that statement at all.

Yeah. And that, that is kind of where I was floored when we talked and you were sharing this with me because one of the big things, you know, I tried several oils. Like I said, I’m not against oils. There actually have been a few that I have used from time to time on me or on my kids. Um, but I just hadn’t really seen a huge impact, especially depending on what I was, was trying to, to fix or an ailment. And you know, people, the biggest thing everyone kept saying is, yeah, even if it doesn’t work as good though it’s a hundred percent natural, it’s so much better for you, it’s so much better for you. And that was constantly what you’re told over and over. And I just feel, you know, especially since so many people are using it now and consuming it and some people are loading it on their skin every day, that people need to be more educated, that, that, that what they’re being told isn’t a hundred percent true.

Yeah. Yeah. And it’s, it’s not being regulated either. And so the important thing to do and the way that we can change this as a consumer is if all of us all of a sudden started saying, Hey, we want to see this data, you know, ask, ask these companies, Hey can you show me the level of solvent that is in this oil? I want to see some quality control. And I think if enough people started barking up that tree then, then we’ll get some answers.

Yeah. Gotcha. So can we talk about, you mentioned like, you know, flowers like Jasmine, but can you talk about specifics of the, the most, you know, not dangerous ones but the ones with the most solvent and these like some specifics?

Yeah. You are not actually that, I don’t know. I know that, I know that they use for all flowers. Um, to the extent, I’m not sure and it would probably take a ton of research to figure it out, but I do know, um, like your, uh,

w maybe in turn instead of that, since you know, you’re saying that pretty much anything that uses flowers, uh, has to do that. What, what are more commonly used, safer oils for people to use? Maybe the, like the ones that you use?

Um, citruses because citrus soil is found in the rind and the Rhine is actually a pretty big part of, of the fruit. Um, so they called press those out. And so those are not really chemically altered. I can’t guarantee that cause I don’t know what companies, you know, add to their oils. Um, but, but just doing some internet searching, um, you know, grapefruit or orange or, and I found that even in my own oil use, I gravitated toward those anyway cause they just made me, um, kind of awake and feel fresh and not like they were chemically a doing anything as big as a medication per se. Um, but, but I would tell people, you know, follow your nose or what feels good, you know, um, if, if an oil gives you a headache, stop using it immediately. Um, that’s what I would say.

Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So the citrus ones are probably the best ones to use or just go to Europe and buy them. Their oils are a lot better over there. Okay. All right. I love that. No, I think it’s interesting because a lot of people don’t know that. And that’s the thing. It’s like there’s no marketing here in the U S it’s so lax compared to the, for example, the European union, like you could put all natural on almost anything you put on Oreos and be like, they’re all natural. It’s like, well yeah, from a chemist point of view, technically I guess. But you know like really is that really healthy? Does that mean it’s healthy? And then the answer is no. But so there’s not anything specific with essential oils that you can look for that says, Hey, this one uses less solvent than these ones that they don’t really market that. At least from what I’ve seen, I’m not in that industry that much. So

I will say working with those companies, every single one of them was very concerned about how the public did perceive them and what their competition was doing. So if they’re competent, they started showing data, then they were going to be right next to them showing that they were better using the same sort of data. So if, if consumers were asking for this sort of data, like what, you know, what is the level of solvent? Um, I do think that they, they’ll respond because, um, they’re, they’re interested in keeping their consumers.

Yeah. I really do think the power is, is in the people and when we start to demand change, you’ll see these big companies eventually start to, to change. And you kind of see it even recently with like subway and McDonald’s with food additives, they put in these foods and preservatives and you know, antibiotics and um, all these other things that they add to foods that chemically enhance them. They’re slowly starting to change because people are demanding it and it’s being exposed and it’s up to us kind of.

Yeah, we’re seeing it on this eye. I’m sure everybody has seen it. Just in those examples that drew said, you know, there’s those bloggers that are well known that have a large audience that write up something about something in Starbucks or something. Like, for example, the subway bread and people share it, people see it, people comment on it, they, and they say how they don’t like that. And then what happens? I think it was within like a month subway changed their, their formula for making an ingredient that was in their bread. So I think a lot of times we think, Oh, you know, me asking or me wondering, or me being curious, like, that’s not gonna make a difference because I’m one person, but the fact is, as consumers, we do have the power to make companies look at things that were not happy and add, change it. So I love that. Maybe we could share this podcast and have,

yeah. Okay. Let’s shift gears a little bit. Tiffany. Let’s talk about a little bit about your food philosophy right as whole fork and how it differs from paleo and then you know, what you see in the paleo, uh, industry that’s, you know, maybe not the healthiest or maybe, you know, kind of controversial.

Okay. Um, well first, okay, let’s talk a little bit about what the paleo diet actually is and that’ll help us out. Um, the paleo diet, I think in the most simplest description says that you should stick to eating food from nature, like vegetables, meat, seafood, fruit, nuts, seeds, healthy fats, and that you should avoid processed food, processed sugar, processed oils, dairy, grains, legumes and alcohol. And when you look at the books, the paleo diet as it was written, um, it was written by dr Loren Cordain, he actually says that you should aim to eat 85% paleo foods and then limit everything else. Um, you know, all that process stuff or dairy, legumes, sugar, whatever, um, limited to about 15% of your diet. And, and I actually totally agree with that and that’s how I try to live is a large percentage of my diet is considered paleo. And then there is a small percentage where I try and keep a healthy balance and that just helps keep me sane. So that’s my food philosophy. And if you look at the core of what the paleo diet actually is, um, I would say I agree with that.

Um, and I like that cause I think, uh, a big problem in the industry, in this fitness industry and I think why sometimes I even struggle in it is because people sometimes become so obsessive where it’s a hundred percent, you know, a hundred percent paleo, a hundred percent, whole, 30, a hundred percent ketogenic, like whatever the lifestyle is, they, they feel like they have to be all or nothing. It can’t be 80% of camp, 85%. And then what I’ve noticed for most of those people, and for some it, it’s worked great. And I know some people have lived a hundred percent paleo lifestyle and maybe sometimes also because they have certain auto immune diseases or it’s a lot better for their body. But in a large majority of people where that’s not the case. I’ve seen that that’s turned into food disorders and obsessive disorders about labeling food and guilt and shame and honestly ultimately unhappiness where they end up still coming to me behind the scenes being like, I can’t eat a cupcake without wanting to cry or without hating myself without hating my body. And I label all the food that I eat is bad or good. And I noticed I’m now passing that onto my kids. Yeah.

And Tiffany, you have a very interesting story experience with this from your past when you first started eating healthy, I believe, is that right?

Yeah, kind of. Um, I first, I first started, or I saw the paleo diet mostly on social media and it was just like Lynn said, a lot of people put it out there that it had to be this 100% thing. And especially, um, people in the whole 30 community. And I started out by doing around a whole 30, which for listeners who don’t know what that is, that’s basically sticking to that, that meal idea. Um, vegetables, meat, fruit, nuts, seeds and healthy oils, 100% for 30 days. And I will say that, um, I think that program, it was really educational and it taught me a lot and it was a good challenge where I learned a lot about food and what actually is healthy versus what isn’t healthy. But I found that for myself and, and I don’t know what percentage of people are like me, so I’m not gonna pretend to assume that, but um, that’s through me for a major Tel spin.

And that was actually, um, it threw me into a tailspin for about a year. And that’s actually when I met drew at this pinners conference cause I heard him talk and I’m like, okay, here’s the guy that has achieved this balance. And I came out of, out of, that’s a very strict way of dieting and truth is I could stick to it for about four to six weeks, but then my emotions and my brain and my body would just go crazy where I didn’t have enough energy and I just needed food to like connect with people and go out to a restaurant and not care about the millions of ingredients that I needed to avoid. And I was feeling really unbalanced. So after like four to six weeks, I would fall off the wagon and then I would fall so far off the wagon, I couldn’t bring myself to eat anything but like pizza and ice cream, which is like way unhealthy, you know?

And so I was really struggling, um, to just find that balance and, and I ping ponged back and forth from like, it had to be a hundred percent totally clean to them falling off the wagon. And it was like, I cannot even look at a vegetable or I might die. Um, and, and then drew, when I met him and you know, he, he’s basically like, you know, check out our website, all of our workouts and even our mill clowns are there on the website. And so I looked at it and I was like, you know, this actually really is kind of the paleo diet. Like most of the, the bulk of the diet is meat and vegetables with healthy oil. And then there’s a few ins here and there, like, maybe it’s a tortilla, maybe it’s half a cup of rice. Me, you know, it’s a little bit of a protein shake that has a sweetener in it, but it’s not, it’s not crazy. And when I eat that way, I feel very balanced and I find that I can stick to my goals and I don’t fall off any crazy wagon and all as well. Yeah. And I think, I think a big part of of that is, is finding your, your

balance and that is going to be different for everybody. Um, I used to be, and I think a lot of, and maybe men can too, but I think especially women can relate to this. I used to be such an emotional eater where I could at night open something like a bag of Oreos and eat the entire thing or like eat an entire carton of ice cream or an entire container of girl scout cookies. And it’s not that I probably, I probably still could do that. Like it’s not that I, I couldn’t do that anymore, but I don’t do that anymore. And it’s really interesting because I feel like I went through years where I would try to force myself to eat a certain way and try to force myself to cut a bunch of things out. And you know, I did for example, you know, 30 days of no dairy and no grains and no, you know, and I was the same as Tiffany where that would happen.

And then I would go so far in the other way and emotionally and physically just binge like crazy. And I found that now that I live more, uh, the approach of intuitive eating where, you know, I do eat healthy grains and meats and vegetables and dairy, you know, from time to time, you know, I don’t consume a ton of dairy, but I definitely have cheeses and you know, I’ll have occasional ice cream or if I was in Europe it was gelato every day. But I mean in general I consume everything in healthy doses. And it’s interesting cause I don’t emotionally eat like that anymore. I don’t go through crazy binges. I actually can eat a piece of cake now and eat half of it and be like, Oh, I either don’t want anymore, I’m full and put it down. That would have never happened before. I could not have left half a piece of cake sitting on a plate.

Well, I think the problem is we turn diets into almost a religion and then we look at it as a sin and we’re bad. You know, we feel guilty. We feel shame for eating that way and we beat ourselves up. We hate ourselves more and we create this vicious cycle. You see it all the time in the paleo or even keto or vegan or whatever, you know, even whole 30 you can turn it that way. But I feel like sometimes it’s good to go through this. You start to develop a better relationship with food. I mean, not everybody that does these hardcore 30 days, you know, all or nothing strict regimens, you know, goes the opposite way. For some people it’s a good jumpstart. I think each person is different, but no matter who you are, to live a healthy lifestyle over the longterm, you have to develop a healthy relationship with food to where it’s not bad.

There’s no guilt or shame associated with eating a cupcake or eating a donut. That’s not how it works. That’s not a healthy relationship with food and, but you gotta figure it out what works for you and you and Lynn and I feel like me and many others have kind of learned over the years. It takes some time to understand what your happy balances with food so that you’re not beating yourself up. You’re not feeling guilt or shame when you eat a certain food that you probably, you know, like, Oh, I shouldn’t eat this. It’s not, it’s not, you know, it’s not a hundred percent paleo or whatever. And I’m just finding that healthy balance with food. There’s no magic black or white program that like, uh, that is going to work. But I feel like, you know, you are a good example, Tiffany, of, of, you know, going through those phases of, you know, uh, being strict and then go on the opposite end and then eventually finding what your healthy balances.

I would totally agree with that. And I’ve also found the, um, being more balanced, I actually enjoy my food way better because you know, when, when it’s like, okay, I’m deciding that I’m going to have this cupcake or donut or whatever it is I’m deciding to have, it is a conscious choice. It isn’t just an emotional reaction to something. And usually it’s because I know that an occasion is coming up and so I’m like, Oh my gosh, they have this most amazing whatever it is. And, and so in my mind, I look forward to it and then when I’m there, I’m present for the experience and I’m not just eating it to medicate some sort of emotion, rather I’m actually tasting it and enjoying the spirit, the experience a whole lot more than I did before.

Yeah, exactly. I completely agree with that. So what are some of the, um, misconceptions you see about the paleo diet that you were going to talk about? Tiffany.

Okay. Um, well first I want to say that I think a lot of these MES are started because the paleo diet has been so incredibly trendy and there are so many media outlets and bloggers and cookbook writers and health gurus that talk about the diet. And there’s a lot of good sounding information out there, but it isn’t all accurate. And so it paints this false picture of what the diet actually is. And like we already mentioned, one of the things is, um, this, you have to be 100% paleo or you’re not really paleo. And that is not even what the creator of the diet wrote. So that one really drives me crazy. You know, it’s funny, I didn’t know that until you said that. Yeah. So we all use the term paleo diet as a way to describe, um, kind of an eating standard, similar to the way we use the term veganism or pescatarian or carnival chrism, something like that.

We use it as a descriptive term and not an actual trademark brand of something. But the paleo diet is actually a trademark diet that was created by Loren Cordain PhD. And the diet just exploded so much that the name paleo diet is now a common term. But I would always tell everybody, if you’re interested in the paleo diet, pick up dr Cordain’s book, the paleo diet. I don’t earn any commission off it. Nothing like that. He doesn’t even know I exist, but he will now maybe. But honestly, if you really want to know what it is about and approach it in a healthy way, I highly recommend his book because there are some myths and misconceptions out there. And the funny thing is I love, um, looking at or watching scientific podcasts, um, or videos and I’m reading articles and there’s a lot of scientists that want to debunk the Abillion diet and tell you how it’s wrong.

And the funny thing to me is that all these scientists are writing this stuff about this book that I don’t think they’ve even read. Because the first myth I’m going to talk about is that the paleo diet is about abandoning our modern agricultural diet and that we should reach far back and return to the diet of our paleolithic ancestors. And this myth I think is mostly just based on the name of the diet, the paleo diet. And people assume that the diet teaches that we should eat like paleolithic people and eat the same food. And it assumes that the diet focuses heavily on meat. I think we conjure up images of eating an unhealthy amount of meat and maybe even eating it raw. I’ve seen people ask it out before and where this is absolutely 100% wrong is the founder of the paleo diet has not said that we should be eating the exact same foods that paleolithic people ate.

And truth is the foods that they ate. They’re no longer biologically available today. So like take lettuce for example. Today’s paleo diet is absolutely filled with salads. I’ve never eaten so many vegetables in my life. Um, but the lettuce from the paleolithic era, it is full of latex and it’s, it’s so bitter that you practically can’t eat it. And the caveman did not eat lettuce. Um, but through modern agricultural technology, we’ve removed the large ribs from lettuce. We’ve removed the bitter taste and the latex. And so now we all enjoy loads and loads of lettuce. Um, another example of this is all of oil. Uh, the paleo diet is full of olive oil except paleo people did not eat or consume all of oil because you have to get it through all those with, um, using a very large press. But the big large tools like this are not part of the paleolithic era.

So they didn’t have all of oil. And so there’s so many examples we could go on and on was like Tito’s bananas, cauliflower. Most of the vegetables we eat today, they, they were not available back then. So really what the diet is saying is that in our modern day, we need to have the same food philosophy that the paleo ancestors had. We don’t have to eat the same foods, just have the same philosophy. And that’s, that’s basically just to hunt and gather foods from nature. And for most of us that is going to be done at the grocery store or the farmer’s market, but that’s where we want to reach for foods that are in their most natural state. And that should be the bulk of our diet. So,

okay. Yeah, I didn’t, I had heard the exact same thing. These are myths that I have still believed in when I hear people talk about, cause that’s the problem is it kind of gets lost in translation work to kind of trickles down to people not reading the book but then just, Oh yeah. Like you know, they hear about it from one person and it’s like telephone, then they pass it on and then it gets down to just the masses. And then again, a lot of it’s misinterpreted, I feel like, and that’s what becomes mainstream. So, um, those are some very good points. And I like that. Um, and I think I read you talking about, um, even just like our gut bacteria is totally different now, so we can digest foods differently versus our ancestors. Um, like lactase persistence for example, you know, um, like some people can tolerate dairy pass, you know, adolescents, um, nowadays versus probably back then we only ate dairy, you know, from our mother’s milk, right?

Yeah, exactly. So this is, this is kind of one point where I disagree with the paleo dust. He says to avoid dairy, and maybe if you count dairy in that 15%, then, then you’re totally fine. Um, but yeah, a lot of paleo people say that, that we don’t have the digestive enzymes and the dairy is totally inappropriate for our diet. And I disagree, especially if you’re from European descent. Um, you have woo, you have definitely evolved too, to have the right enzyme, um, to digest dairy even into adulthood. And I know, I ha, I have no issues with dairy and not that I eat it all the time and I have noticed it if I eat too much dairy, you know, um, my skin might break out. I used to have seasonal allergies and asthma, but keeping dairy down into like that 15%, I no longer have any of those issues. Um, so I don’t think there is a problem eating dairy. And I think this is where people just need to be smart about your body and listen to your body more than paying attention to the rules of certain diets.

Yeah. Yeah. I know for me, like growing up, I know I was lactose intolerant, just, you know, back in the day, you know, it was very highly processed dairy, very low quality. So I know that I had a stomach issues with it, but now that I’ve come to know my body a lot better, you know, for example, I’ve been doing keto for some time now and I can incorporate, you know, certain types of dairy and be fine with it. My stomach’s totally fine eating some cheeses. Um, but like I know for example, if I make dairy with sugar, it’s over, you know, it’s not a good, so I know that dairy come out with any type of carbs for me does not work well. Whereas if I buy dairy from grass fed cows for example, that aren’t fed any hormones or antibiotics, my dad, my, my, my digestion system, my digestive system can process that a lot easier. So yeah, these are all very good points and I appreciate you kind of split.

You know, the one thing that I, I do think is great about doing some sort of, um, stricter diet. Like let’s just use for example, the whole 30 is if you really following it the way it’s supposed to be, which is to do it for 30 days and that’s it. It’s not a lifestyle. It’s not that you continually eat that way, you do it and then you slowly integrate in back foods to see how your body responds. So let’s say you start, you know, you had cut out dairy for a while and then you slowly integrate dairy back in and see how your body responds to it. That’s a great way to gauge if you know your, if you do do well with dairy and like Tiffany said, maybe it’s even something like you digest it. Okay. But you notice your skin breaks out and you don’t like that. But for me, you know, I have gone off dairy and grains and sugar for 30 days and then slowly reintegrated things back in and I do fine with dairy. I do fine with grains. Um, I do find with sugar sometimes, like Tiffany was saying, I do get a little bit more breakouts. Um, and I guess ultimately I’m like, I’d rather have ice cream and is it, but it’s fine, you know, but at least at least you know how your body responds to specific food groups.

Yeah, exactly. While we’re running up on time here, Tiffany, but before we go, we’ll have the last few questions, but before we get into those questions, where can people find you if they want to get in touch with you? Social media and website and all that.

Yeah, so my website pretty simple. It’s whole, so w H O L E F O R And I’m also on Instagram at whole fork and that’s it.

Okay. So now Snapchat, Facebook, Twitter.

I keep it pretty. Yes I am. I am on Pinterest, I’m just again at whole fork. Um, but I do keep things pretty simple. If you do have any specific questions for me, I’m usually pretty good at answering email and I’m just Tiffany at [inaudible] dot com.

Gotcha. And you don’t do the Tiffany go follow her. Yes. Her food is beautiful. I wish I could take photos of my food, but I have like horrible lighting and anyway, she knows how to do it. Um, so you’re so really quick to end. You’re no longer a chemist. Do you do the chemist gig anymore or no?

No, actually I quit about a year ago and um, you know, my family was just getting really, really busy and my husband’s career took off and we kind of had to make a choice about, um, whose career was going to be, uh, we’d focus on and then it actually quitting allows me to have a little bit more time doing whole forks, so it just worked out.

Gotcha. Okay. Well that’s cool. Congrats

on taking that plunge. It’s a scary plunge

to, you know, ourselves back. You know, we were married and I fit, fit, fit, took off and um, you know, it is kind of scary but you know, it’s, I think it’s worth the risk. So anyways. Okay. Tiffany, last few questions for you. What is your favorite cheat meal?

Wait, are we doing the lightning round? Cause you can’t, you can’t go into it like that. You didn’t ask drew when I’m not around things kind of slide through the cracks. Okay. We are going into the, the lightning round, which is where we asked Tiffany a series of questions that really aren’t important to anybody but maybe to me because I care about the little intricacies of life instead of just health and wellness. So Tiffany, we’re going to ask you a series of questions, answer them as quickly and as fast as possible. All right? Okay. So first thing that comes to mind, no filtering. Okay, here we go. Alright, here we go. Okay, drew, you can do it now.

Okay. What is your favorite, how do you process unhealthy food that you, that’s your go to?

Um, chocolate. Chocolate. Yeah, just about in any form. Dark chocolate on ice cream on donuts. It’s definitely just chocolate.

So any kind of chocolate, there’s no like chocolate you avoid?

Uh, no. Well I do look for like good chocolate because I have traveled and that was my little tradition actually was I would try and find the best chocolate and that’s what I would bring home to my kids. So we would track these different chocolates from all around the world.

Mm. I love that.

Um, I really liked Polish chocolate. Um, and uh, Helsinki had really great chocolate. They put a lot of different things in, so it’s awesome.

Gotcha. What’s your favorite book that you’ve read?

Oh my gosh. I know that’s a hard one.

That is hard.

Your top three maybe.

Uh, you don’t even have to say why you don’t say my top three authors. I am a John. I’m a John Grisham fan. I read it that a single one of his books. At one point I wanted to be a lawyer and um, I really liked Michelle Moran. She writes historical novels and she has written a few books on Egypt and I am obsessed with Egypt history maybe.

Oh cool. Are you, you know, you’re not part Egypt are you?

I wish seriously. Out of all the places I’ve been in the world, Cairo was hands down my favorite.

Okay, cool. I’ll have to add that to the list. Okay. What is one of the most, what do you think is something very interesting or different about you that would surprise people? Aside from being the hottest scientists? It’d be like a hobby

or talent or anything, but something that would be surprising or interesting about you. Um, I,

my favorite hobby, the most fun thing I’ve ever done my entire life is I’m obsessed with motorcycles and I drive a Honda seven 50 I’m kind of looking for something bigger at this point, but I go on overnight road trips about once a month and I love it. Awesome. Do you do this with your husband? Yep, we do. Yeah, we do it together. It’s kind of the fun thing we found to do together.

I love that. Yeah. I knew that about you. I’ve seen your bike motorcycle and I loved that. I remember when you told me, I was like, cause I took motorcycle lessons when I was like 18 and I was like I love that. I love the Sturgis ever. Or isn’t that what motor?

No, I think well yes, but he doesn’t,

she doesn’t want to do surges. I’m always like, I think we should just to say we did, but mostly we go to the national parks like um, we keep going to Montana lately cause Montana is beautiful.

Yeah. Okay. Montana is beautiful. Last question. Tiffany. I know you’ve been pregnant with what? Three kids? Not the last one for me, but it’s the last one for drew. Okay. You’ve been pregnant three kids, right?

No, actually I have two stepdaughters and then one biological son.

I did not. Okay. I did not know that. So you’ve had you given birth to one? Yes. How much weight did you gain?

Oh my gosh. Like [inaudible]. Yeah.

Okay to ask. Yeah, it was horrible. I gained like 60 pounds. It was awful.

And how long did it take for you to lose it?

I would say about 40 of it came off really quick without really trying anything. And then the last 30 probably took about nine months.

Hmm. Wow. See that’s good for people to know. Of course now I do agree for women, you know, we are really hard on ourselves and it’s interesting cause you know, you gain the weight over nine months and then you expect it to lose it quicker than you gained it, which is unrealistic.

Yeah. And it takes your skin, I mean, sorry if this is too much information, but you know, your skin needs to rebuild that Alasta city. It takes months and months and months and we just need to be kinder to ourselves about the whole process.

Yes. Amen. I agree 100%. Okay. Your favorite trashy television show?

Oh my gosh. Um, well right now I’m like watching the empire diary.

[inaudible] husband makes fun of me. I love it. You know, intelligent scientists slash vampire diaries. I just love that. Cairo motorcycle. Tiffany’s fascinating. You guys weird. I’m weird. It’s weird. You’re fascinating. I love it.

I’ll say it on here. We’re not supposed to curse, but

right. It’s exception.

That’s an exception. Okay. Thank you so much Tiffany for coming on. A lot of knowledge bombs here in this episode. We appreciate it and we hope to talk to you in the future, so please stay in touch.

Good. She got Tiffany. You guys check her out. I’ll see you guys later. Bye.

All right everyone. Hopefully you enjoyed today’s episode with Tiffany from whole Make sure you check her out on social media. She’s got a ton of great recipes that taste really good. She’s awesome. She’s amazing. Let us know what you thought of this episode. Um, if you guys enjoyed this episode, please subscribe on iTunes so that way you get notified each time we release a new episode, subscribe on iTunes, leave us a review please. Um, that definitely helps our rankings. Uh, I would definitely appreciate if he has left was an honest review. I’m not telling asking you guys to lie and say this is the best podcast ever, but you know, if it is, then tell us that. But if not, then just, you know, leave us a review. Let us know what we can do better. We appreciate your support and honesty and um, you guys are awesome.

Okay. To stay in touch with me, you guys, you know, where you can find me at fit to fat to fit on social media, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Snapchat, everything. My website is fit to fat to Check out my new ebook that I just launched just a couple of weeks ago, right after I did the Spartan race. I have an eight week Spartan race training program or tough Mudder. So any of those types of mud runs. This is a great detailed workout program for you to try. You can do the workouts from your own home, uh, if you want to, uh, very detailed. Uh, it definitely is the way I prepare for these races. And so even if you aren’t doing this ratio, definitely find these workouts is very challenging but with great benefits to lean out, uh, become more functionally fit. Uh, so check it force. I shop for that. And Lynn, as you know, she is on all social media at to fit at home. That’s her website. That’s her Facebook, that’s her Twitter, Instagram, Snapchat, all of that. So thank you guys for tuning in again. Uh, next week we will have another great episode. So please tune in each week for great content and we’ll see you back here on the fit to fat fit experience podcast.

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